Friday, December 30, 2005
Weekend Trip
We might be heading straight from there to Michigan. We don't know...so if you want to reach us it will have to be through e-mail or this blog.
If I don't post before Sunday...talk to you next year...
Wednesday, December 28, 2005
Time Warp
Yesterday was a classic example of living in a time warp. The only consistency in my day is when I first wake up. Isabella wakes me up every morning at percisely 8AM. Her and I then go eat a bowl of cereal and try to find something to do untill we wake up the mom around 10. After that the day is pretty much up in the air. Yesterday after everyone was awake and we all showered I looked at the clock and saw that it was 1:30 in the afternoon!
WHAT? What happened to the day???
So we went for a drive to the library, got some movies, went to see Julie, picked up a pizza, and drove back home. After all that I was hungry...it was dark, so I got dinner set on the table. After we ate I again looked at the clock...and it was 4:20.
WHAT??? I ate dinner at 4:20??? Now what do I do with the rest of my night?
So I was quite confused yesterday...that is what I am talking about when I say I need some sort of structure!
This weekend we are planning on visiting some friends from Bible school.
Funny story...When we were students years ago we became friends with a single guy named Jared. He came over quite a bit and we really had a good time with him. Quite independently from that we became friends with a girl names Erin. Again the same story, she came over alot, and we had a good friendship with her. Never once did they ever come over at the same time...I don't think that they ever really talked much. After we left school we hear that they were dating, now they are married and have a baby! Crazy! In all our years we never even saw them in the same room together, now we will get to live with them for a few days as a married couple. We are really looking forward to it. After this weekend we are planning on visiting Grant and Sarah in Michigan for a couple days as well. I think that things will start getting back to "normal" soon. Well, at least I won't be thinking that the walls are closing in on me any longer!!
Sunday, December 25, 2005
Saturday, December 24, 2005
Christmas Eve
I am thankful that Jen and I are able to talk with each other. Even though some hard things come up and our emotions are raw, I much prefer that then silence!
We are planning on going to church with Gary, Kathy and family tomorow. It will be good to get out of the house and spend some time worshiping God with a group of believers. It is easy for us to lose focus on what is the true meaning for the season, and get wrapped up in what we are going through right now, but God is still God, and because of His coming to earth over 2000 years ago, we can have the peace and the hope that we are feeling today.
We wanted to say Merry Christmas to everyone and thank everyone who has been here for us during this time. We will get to personal thank-you's when we can, but for now..."THANK-YOU!!".
Merry Christmas from the Phlaum family.
(Isabella is excited about her new baby doll.)
Thursday, December 22, 2005
Origin of Anarazell's Name
She told us somthing interesting. Most children in the Philippines are named after someone in the family, usually the parents. Even Girlie got her name by getting the "G" from one parent and the "lie" from another. She had no idea that there was anything different about her name until she came to the States for the first time, and found out the "girlie" means something here.
So the original Anarazell probably got the "Ana" from her mom and "razell" from some other relative.
This was a fun bit of info to find out, because we were naming her for a family member as well.
Isabella's middle name is Lynn, after Jen and Patty's, (Jen's mom) middle names. My middle name is Andrew after my mom's Ann. So before we had picked a name out yet, I was trying to find a name that we could make the middle name "Ann" or have the "Ann" sound somewhere in it. So when Jen wanted Anarazell, it fit perfect.
We picked a Filipino name and we were cultural about it, and we didn't even know it! I find that pretty cool!
Wednesday, December 21, 2005
Rough Day...
Pretty crazy...
Tuesday, December 20, 2005
Discharged
When I first heard about her, all I could think about was getting people to pray for her...and I knew that praying people read this blog...so all I wanted to do was get her on here! Thank you everyone who prayed.
Jen and I had our first night alone last night. Grant and Sarah left Sunday afternoon with an invite to visit them in Michigan soon, if we want to. So we settled down and started getting ready for our first "alone" night then, but two friends stopped by and we ended up having dinner with them. I like impromptu things like that. It is so hard to plan anything still.
So last night we played, "plegos" with Isabella and after she went to bed we just sat and talked. Alot to talk about. It is almost like we have to get to know each other all over again. We have both changed through this, and I don't think that we ourselves even know to what extent yet. So it was a good time. Nothing serious was discussed, just had a good time talking.
We loved family and friends being here, but I think it kinda distracts you from what has happened, so now that we are alone I think alot of healing will now begin. Going to be a long road I think.
Please keep us in your prayers...
Monday, December 19, 2005
Mariah
I guess that it is a "common" illness that can affect babies her age and size. Jen was talking to Heidi last night and they sound like they are doing pretty good. They said that Mariah looks sad...but she is going to be fine. Praise the Lord!! When we got the call that they had been life-fighted, Jen just broke down in tears, and my brain kinda froze. Way too soon for us for something like this to be happening.
When Jen was on the phone I kept hearing her say, "Wait, we are talking about you right now..." Heidi just kept asking Jen how we were and if we were ok!
So, thank you all for your prayers. Please don't stop now. They didn't give us a time frame for how long that they will be in the hospital, but they did say that Mariah was going to stay until she was completly recovered...might make for an interesting Christmas.
I am going to pray that she is home before then...
Sunday, December 18, 2005
Urgent Prayer Request...
Jen and I are staying in a house of a couple that is going to the Bible School here in Wisconsin. They have a Son, Daughter-in-law and two grand-children that Jen and I have been in school with and friends with for three years now.
Josh and Heidi are the parents and they have a two year old boy, Micah, and a baby, Mariah, that was born just a couple weeks before Anarazell.
The are in Missouri right now.
We just heard that they took Mariah to the hospital for "respitory problems" and the local hospital wasn't capable of handling her situation...so she was life-flighted to a bigger hospital.
At this point that is all that I know. Bigger hopital might mean St. Louis...Kansas City...Colombia...I don't know.
Please pray. We had so much prayer offered up for us...by many people that don't even know us...so please pray for this situation too. For Mariah, that she would get better...for the doctors, that they would know what is going on...for Josh and Heidi as they are going to be going through a lot of the same feelings that Jen and I felt early on in Anarazell's life. Even pray for little Micah. I don't know whay is going on with him right now, where he is staying, what he is thinking...all that.
Dear God,
We want to lift up this family right now. Please comfort Josh and Heidi. Please. We know that you are in control, just as you have always been, and just impress that on Josh and Heidi right now. Give them such a peace, please. Let them know that people are praying for them, and their little baby girl. Please, Lord, heal little Mariah. Give the doctors wisdom as they look at her. Give Micah a special hug, and let him know that even though things are going to be weird for a little while, that he'll be ok, and that his mom and dad...thought distracted, still love him.
In Jesus name, Amen
When I get more info, I will pass it along.
Saturday, December 17, 2005
Friday, December 16, 2005
New Number
Nothing new and inspirational to write.
I sat down for a while this afternoon...and couldn't think of anything to say. Figured that if I feel like I am forcing something...then it is best not to write at all.
Jen's mom left yesterday, and Tom and Grace are leaving tomorrow. We will probably have Grant and Sarah until Monday, then we will be on our own. It will be the first time since before Anarazell died that we will have no one with us. It might be a little wierd at first, but I think it will be good.
With Tom and Grace leaving for Christmas break...my use of their cell phone will come to an end. It has been such a blessing to have. If you want to call us, (and please do...) the home phone number is 262-513-9719. Leave a message if we don't answer. E-mail is a way that you can always get ahold of us...honeybugs@gmail.com
It is Grant's birthday today, so we will be having a cake soon. Funny how life goes on...
Thursday, December 15, 2005
Psalm 139
When Jen and I speak in different churchs and they ask me to share my personal testimony, I always start in this particular Psalm...at exactly the same verse.
The only dad that I have ever known, married my mother when I was about 7 years old. Not too long after that, we (my twin and I), went through the adoption process and became "Phlaums".
As time went by I learned more and more about my past and my biological father. Not a very nice story. The awesome thing that came out of it was: on the night my twin and I were conceived...my mother became a believer in Jesus Christ.
From the day of my conception...God has been looking out for me. And in my testimony, I always start there.
Then Tom read these exact verses, as if Anarazell was saying them to God.
13 For You formed my inward parts; You covered me in my mother’s womb.
14 I will praise You; for I am fearfully and wonderfully made; marvellous are thy works; and that my soul knows very well.
15 My frame was not hid from You, when I was made in secret, and skillfully wrought in the lowest parts of the earth.
16 Your eyes saw my substance, being yet unformed; and in Your book all my members were written, The days were fasioned for me, when as yet there was none of them.
Anarazell's days here on earth were only 14...but God knew that a long time ago.
Even our little Anarazell...who come to this earth, not fully formed...can say to the creator God,
17 "How precious also are your thoughts to me, O God! How great is the sum of them!
18 If I should count them, they would be more in number then the sand; When I awake, I am still with You"
When she woke up...she was still with Him.
This Psalm meant alot to me before...but from now on it will probably be my favorite scripture.
Wednesday, December 14, 2005
Random Pictures
One of the few cute pictures of her feet. No matter what we tried, she always held her feet like this.
Isabella with her friend Hailey. Our daughter is 2 1/2 and Hailey is 8! Bella is a big girl, while Hailey is a bit short for her age.
More encouragers. Our friends Grant and Sarah got out of school early in order to come and visit with us during this time.
Tuesday, December 13, 2005
Emotional Roller-coaster
People, who have been here before, try to help, and I am very thankful for their imput, but this is something that you have to live through on your own...day by day.
Friday our Anarazell went to be with the Lord.
Less then a half an hour later Jen and I were walking out of the hospital and there would have been no way that you would have guessed what we had just been through had you seen us. It was bazaar. I looked at Jen and said, "There is no way that I could explain the peace that I am feeling right now."
And there isn't.
Is it "The peace that passes all understanding?"
Is it grace that is given when one of God's children have to go through a tribulation?
Is it both?
Whatever it is, it is a blessing. Jen and I can laugh together, we can talk about what we went/are going through. We even get out of bed in the morning...and welome the new day.
It isn't all easy. We aren't amazing people by any means.
Last night I was scanning the radio stations and I came across an "old time" radio show. Thinking it would be a break from the normal music that is played...I left it there. In less than 3 minutes of listening it was talking about a baby that was born dead.
Talk about blind-sided. Instant tears.
We have a long road ahead. We know that God is going to make it as easy as He can for us...but we are going to have to walk it.
Please pray for strength day by day, and that we keep looking to Him for that strength.
Sunday, December 11, 2005
Questions...
Where did we get the name Anarazell?
Years ago, Jen and I used to recieve pictures from one of those "Adopt a Child" places and we always put the pictures on the 'fridge and prayed for the children. One day we got a picture of a girl from the Philippines and her name was Anarazell, and we just fell in love with it. Jen loved the name Isabella as well, and our first daughter recieved that name...I'm not exactly sure why, but that is how it worked out...
What are our plans now that it is all over?
Excellent question...
Tom and Grace, who we are staying with, will be in California for all of the Christmas break, so they said that we can stay here if we want to. We think we do. If we went back to our school in Missouri almost everyone that we know will be on break as well, and we will be alone in a house full of baby things...so we think that we will wait here for a while. After that we don't know what we are going to do.
Are you planning on having more children?
Right now I would answer, no. Everthing is way too fresh to think about doing it again. 25% Odds that this can happen again... I can't even imagine going through this again.
What are your plans with Anarazell's body?
We don't know when we will ever be back in Wisconsin again, so burying her body here or in Missouri seems silly to us. Having her body shipped out to Oregon seems like an unnecessary expence to us. We know that she is no longer in that body... So we are going to have her cremated. Whenever we make it back to our home church in So.Oregon we will bring the ashes there and we can bury them on the church property. There is a little memorial ground there. Jen and I will probably find a nice river rock that we like and have something carved into that...
Well, those are all the questions I can think about now...if you have more, feel free to call or write. Don't be afraid to contact us. We would love to talk to people and we have no problem talking about our little girl...
It is still hard, but we still know that God is in control, and whatever we are going through is part of His perfect plan.
Saturday, December 10, 2005
Pictures Of Our Last Time...
Our final "Good-bye".
She looks beautiful without all the hoses, huh? and now she is perfect.
Welcome home dear Anarazell...We love you.
Friday, December 09, 2005
The End...
Around 2:15 today our Anarazell Joy got to see her Creator.
If you have been praying for a miracle...it has happened...she is now perfect.
If you have been praying that she would get to go home...she has.
It was the hardest, the most heartbreaking thing in the world, to say to the nurse...
"We're ready".
She went very easy.
There was only one pose that we wanted a picture of without all her hoses, and we wanted to kiss her on the mouth...something we were unable to do with all the hoses.
After that we just held, hugged, kissed and cried over her until she went to be with the Lord. Only thing I could say was..."Into your hands, Oh Lord, I commit my daughter's spirit..."
She was so small.
Please...please keep praying for us. Our road hasn't now ended...it is just beginning in many ways.
Pray for Jen's sweet spirit...I don't want her to get hard.
Pray for Isabella. We saw her today for a while, and she was busy cutting and pasting a card for, "Her little sister". When I told her that Anarazell died today her face just fell, and she said, "Don't say baby died...this is for her".
Pray for me as I grieve for my daughter...and help my family at the same time...
God, we know you are in control, and have done everything for a reason. We don't understand...and don't see what you are doing right now, but we accept it by faith. Lord, I want to believe, please help my unbelief.
Anarazell...Day 14
We spent the morning with both our daughters at the hospital. It was so sweet to see Isabella holding her sister and wiping the bubbles off her mouth. She took that as her personal chore and did it consistantly all morning. She got to help sponge bathe Anarazell, hold her, dress her and take lots of pictures with her.
Isabella "knows" that her baby sister is going to die. I don't know to what extent she comprehends that...but she knows. She came to Jen today as we were all together and said,
"Our baby not die today...I like her."
Talk about tear your heart out...
Then we went back to our friends house, (Julie and Brian) and ate dinner and rested for a bit. Jen, her mom, (Patty) and I went back to the hospital to meet our friends there. It started snowing around 2 and by 6 the roads were crazy! Thankfully we made it safe and had a good time with all the folks that we had last Thursday.
Tom read from Psalms 139 and when I have time I will write those verses out and talk about how those were the perfect verses to read.
Everyone left after a few hours, and Jen and I stayed with our daughter until just a little while ago when we made it back home...(It is still snowing...)
Later on today...around 11AM Jen and I are heading back into the NICU for the last time.
The hospital will be the only home we will ever know for our baby. After much prayer from us and people around the world...we have decided that we are going to remove the life support from our daughter.
Her brain never developed totally, and short of a miracle in the next few hours it will never grow. She can't do anything on her own, and if we chose to leave her this way...she would die shortly from any number of things.
It struck me, as we figured out what time we would end up at the hospital tomorrow, that 11AM is exactly 2 weeks ago...to the hour...when we meet the mid-wife and the roller-coaster that has been our life recently started.
I can't imagine what it is going to be like to hold my baby...and watch her take her last breath...and I have to go throught it soon. I am still praying that God takes her and all we have to do is get a call...
In the morning I will try to post some pictures of the "party" with Isabella and Anarazell. They looked so beautiful together...
Thursday, December 08, 2005
Anarazell...Day 13
Today is going to be even bigger.
We are bringing Isabella in for the first time to say "hi" and "bye" to her little sister. We are all going to dress up and have a "Good-bye Party".
It is going to be a bitter-sweet time. Glad that Isabella can see Anarazell, but knowing that it will be the only time here on earth.
After that we will bring Bella home for a nap...rest ourselves for a while, and then go back in with our friends that came last Thursday when we found out that Anarazell wasn't going to make it.
(Has it has only been a week since that day?)
So us and our friends will be with her, and they will all get to say good-bye.
I will try to post some pictures of the party when we get home tonight.
We'll see how I am feeling.
I know I will be on here tonight, but we'll see what the conversation is about...
Wednesday, December 07, 2005
Different Thoughts
The nurse was asking Jen and I some questions today to finalize our plans for this week, and she looked at us and said..."You two seem to be taking it well, or is this just an act?" I didn't know what to say, I guess that it would have been a great opportunity to explain about the hope that is in us...But I just stood there...looked at my wife...and we both kinda smiled.
It is hard..and it is going to get harder...but God is with us, and we will be alright, and our Anarazell will be perfect soon...so everything is going to be ok...
Jen and I started a tradition with our Isabella a long time ago. Before we tuck her in at night, we sing her two songs, and pray with her. We sing songs that I learned as a kid...ones with lots of hand motions and things like that. It is a fun thing to do as a family. The other night, Jen and I decided to sing to Anarazell before we went home. So we started to sing the familiar song, "He's got the whole world in His hands". We got to the verse about the "little bitty baby" and we broke down. Then we started to sing,
"My God is so Great,
So strong and so mighty,
There's nothing my God can not do"
Hmmmm.
Jesus Loves me...
So different when we are singing it to our baby whose time here on earth will soon be over, and when we are just singing our 2 year old to sleep.
Our Gos IS so great.
He DOES have the babies in his hands.
Jesus DOES love me.
Alright enough for now.
All of our family is leaving tomorow, except for Jen's mom, who will stay until, whenever, to be with Jen.
It was good to visit and just sit and talk to family. Sad that it was so short.
I will especially miss my twin. Of all the people that I talk to, (except my wife), Jeremy knows me the best. We have chosen to walk different road here on earth, but we have always kept in touch and have always been there for each other. It was good to just hang out with him and talk through some stuff. I love you, Bro
Tuesday, December 06, 2005
More Pictures...
We got out one night and walked around the "open house" at the Bible School. Here is Isabella decorating a cookie.
Me in the middle, my twin, Jeremy on my right and Jen's Brother, Brian on my left. All looking at the little girl. I wonder what different thoughts are going through each of our heads?
Monday, December 05, 2005
Day 10
One thing that was a bit different, is that they are leaning toward the idea that there could be a one in four chance that this will happen again. 25% chance. Not good odds for our future family.
So far, it looks like Isabella will be a only child. It still isn't a total fact, but it "looks" that way right now.
Pretty weird. The odds that Jen and I would both have this certain "resessive gene" and both pass it on to our child are so great...but it happened, and we aren't willing to risk it again.
Please be praying for Jen in this. She has wanted nohting more in her life then to be a mommy, and to have this taken away from her in this way...it will be hard. We thank God that we have Isabella. It would be much harder if Anarazell was our first child...
Pretty tired and stressed today. Trying to learn to let God have control in every aspect of our lives...in othe things, including the life of our daughter...
Sunday, December 04, 2005
Song to the Lord
When trying a servent or molding a man.
Give thanks to the Lord, though your testing seems long,
In darkness He giveth a song.
Oh rejoice in the Lord,
He makes no mistakes,
He knoweth the end of each path that I take,
For when I am tried and purified,
I shall come forth as gold.
I could not see through the shadows ahead,
So I looked at the face of my Saviour instead,
I bowed to the will if the master that day,
And peace came and tears fled away.
Oh Rejoice in the Lord...
Now I can see, testing comes from above,
God chasens His children, and purges in love,
My Father knows best, and I trust in His care,
Through purging more fruit I will bear.
Oh Rejoice in the Lord...
-Ron Hamilton
Dear God, we sing this song, knowing that what you do is good, and just and true. We don't always feel what we are saying in this song, but we sing it in faith.
Saturday, December 03, 2005
Reaching Overwhelmed...
Family is making their appearance now. Jen's mom and dad came yesterday, her brother is on his way today, three of my family will come tomorrow. While it will be good to see everyone, it is different since we aren't at our own house, and they are all staying at different places, and our schedual gets moved around alot...Good but stressful. We miss just coming in and sitting with our Anarazell and just talking to her. Now the room is always full, pictures are being taken like crazy. Don't get me wrong, I am not saying that I wish they all weren't here, it is just different.
Next week is coming up quick. All kinds of issues are running through my head. When can the family sit down with the doctors and ask their questions? When should we have our "going away" party? When should Jen and I come in and let our baby go home? Who do we ask to drive us to the hospital...wait for us...and take us home after she is gone? How do you ask someone to do that?
And then the big question...what then?
Jen asked when were we going home, and I asked, "Where is home"?
Our family and alot of church family is in S.Oregon, but we haven't lived there for over 5 years now. We loved our time in Eastern Oregon, but what is there for us now? We have a church family just over the border in Idaho...but we have never lived there...We have only been in Missouri for a few monthes now, so even though most of our stuff is there, we don't consider it home.
I guess it is too early yet...It is hard to make plans for dinner, let alone for that far in advanced.
So all we have settled on so far is staying at the house we are at through Christmas break...and see what happens from there.
Lord willing in the next month or so we will get some direction on what future plans hold...
I am assuming that life continues to go on...I just don't know how.
Just something else for everyone to pray for...
Beautiful Ladies...
Jen's parents came to meet the baby.
What we usually look like when the end of the day comes. We had Isabella with us for the first night in a couple days, so we took her to bed to "snuggle" a bit...
Different Focus
So, when I get a chance I want to talk a bit about how God is working in and through others.
The first thing that I want to mention is the love and prayer that we are recieving. We are amazed, shocked and sometimes overwhelmed at the amount of people who have been praying for us, calling us, sending us gifts and cards, e-mailing us and commenting on our blog. It is amazing how the Body of Christ works.
We are staying with a couple that we have never meeet before this week. Tom and Grace have given us a cell phone to use, the keys to their house, money for stuff and comfort beyond belief...to someone who they didn't know, but needed help. When we found out our baby wasn't going to make it, no one from our family was in town, but this couple along with Brian and Julie, (who have been watching our daughter everyday) and Kathy, (whose house we were supposed to have Anarazell at) all came and just loved us. Talked, read the Bible, brought food and coffee and held our baby. It was like we had known them all our whole lives and it was the most natural thing to have them there with us.
We got a message on our voice mail the other day from a couple who are complete strangers and have lived through the NICU life and just "happened" to come acrossed our blog...(maybe God's work here?) and called us to say that they are praying for us and if we need to talk, they are here. I was amazed that someone would have enough courage to call a complete stranger and tell them this, and then I recognized the area-code from Oregon... our home state! What are the odds that someone from home with the same experience as us right now would stumble acrossed our blog?
We have gotten money from people, that we know for a fact, have no money. We have been with some of these people in the training for several years now, and we know their financial state...and they are sending what they have to us. Amazing. A church that we have never been to sent us several hundred dollars. Never stepped foot in their door before.
What else...Calls, comment, prayers, e-mails, cards, money, food, a place to live...God is taking care of us. It is like He knows that we need to go through this, but He will make it as easy as possible.
Well, it is late, or early, depending on how you look at it. Tomorrow is a new day with tons of new challenges...
Just wanted to let everyone know that We see that God is in control, and just to encourage you a bit in this, as so many of you have encouraged us...
Friday, December 02, 2005
Worth a Thousand Words...
She has been seeing more of him then us these days.
Please keep her in your prayers about this.
The night we got the news that our baby girl would be going home, this is the "family" that came to comfort us.
It is a crazy story how we all got together over the years.
(sorry Kathy about the eyes, well get a better pic soon...)
Day 7
I was spending some time with Isabella playing blocks today, and I started gently letting her know that our baby won't be coming home from the hospital. Of course you have the immediate questions.
Why? What's going to happen to her? Where is she going?
I know there are different theologys out there regarding infants and heaven, but I believe what I told my Isabella. That Anarazell will go to be with God, and sit on His lap. And then she won't be sick anymore.
She played a bit with me and asked some more questions, but she took it well...so far.
Jen went out with our friend Julie, the one at the birth, and they went shopping for clothes. Regardless of what happens, we want Isabella to meet Anarazell once on this earth. So the ladies got them matching outfits to wear together. They bought some other fun stuff, and I guess that we are starting to plan a good-bye party.
I am begging God that HE takes her home before I have to make a descision. I can't do that...I can't sit with my wife and hold my baby as she leaves.
Oh, God please...
Thursday, December 01, 2005
Anarazell...Day 6
All the things I valued most,
Until I was empty-handed,
Every glittering toy was lost.
Then I walked earth's highway greaving,
In my rags and poverty,
'Till I heard His voice inviting,
Lift your empty hands to me.
So I raised my hands t'ward heaven,
And He filled them with a store,
Of His own transendent riches,
'Till they could contain no more.
Then at last I comprehended,
In this stupid mind and dull,
That God could not poor His riches,
Into hands already full.
I heard this song when I was about ten, and it is the one that has been running through my head this whole week. When this all started...only six days ago now...I was talking to my pastor from S.Oregon and I mentioned that I have nothing else to give. My hands are empty. I said that all I have left is a life of a family member, and I wasn't ready to give that up.
Well, it looks like God thinks I am.
We meet with the docs today, and our beautiful Anarazell will never get better in this life. She can't breath, digest, hear, see or think. She is only kept alive by modern technology.
Our baby is going to go to heaven, and there is nothing I can do about it, but choose when.
I have known her for less then a week, and I feel like my heart is being torn out.
I didn't know it was possible to hurt so bad.